Saying Kaddish after the Beginning of Pesukei DeZimra
Question
I am a mourner, and in the place where I pray, many times there is no minyan at the beginning of the prayer service, and the minyan gathers only in the middle of Pesukei DeZimra.
It is known that there are poskim who permit a mourner to interrupt in the middle of Pesukei DeZimra in order to say Kaddish when the minyan gathers.
My question is: Is it preferable lechatchilah to wait and not begin Pesukei DeZimra until there is a minyan, even though as a result I will generally have to shorten Pesukei DeZimra in order to manage to pray Shemoneh Esrei with the congregation, or perhaps is it preferable to begin Pesukei DeZimra in its proper order, and if necessary to interrupt to recite Kaddish?
Additionally, is there a distinction in this regard between Mourner’s Kaddish and Kaddish DeRabbanan, or are their laws the same for this purpose? Thank you very much.
Answer
Greetings and blessings
If a minyan assembled only after they began the berachah of “Baruch She’amar,” one should not recite the Kaddish customarily said before “Baruch She’amar” in the middle of Pesukei DeZimra.
An orphan within the eleven months who is in the middle of Pesukei DeZimra may interrupt and say Kaddish for his father and mother.
However, if possible, they should say it between one chapter and another, or at least at a place where a subject has concluded. And some have written that if he will find another minyan
in which to say it, he should not say it.
Source
And these are the words of our teacher Rabbi Amram Fried shlita, in the Azmera Lishmecha bulletin:
The Responsa Pnei Yehoshua (Orach Chaim siman 5, cited in Be’er Heitev siman 53 se’if katan 3, and in Sha’arei Teshuvah siman 51 se’if katan 2) writes: “A group that did not have a minyan before Baruch She’amar, and they began to say Pesukei DeZimra, and a minyan arrived—it is forbidden to say Kaddish within Pesukei DeZimra.” The reason for this is that since there was no minyan before Hodu, they consequently did not become obligated in this Kaddish, and therefore one may not interrupt for it in the middle of Pesukei DeZimra.
This is also what was written in the Siddur Beit Oved (laws of Pesukei DeZimra, letter 13), and he explained that the reason
is that since the Kaddish before Hodu is only a custom, one may not interrupt in the middle of Pesukei DeZimra in order to say it.
However, the Chida (Kesher Godel, siman 7, se’ifim 35–36) wrote that they may say
Kaddish. The reason may be explained as follows: since according to the Arizal (Pri Etz Chaim, Sha’ar HaKaddishim), it is part of the order and necessity of the prayer service to say Kaddish DeRabbanan before
Hodu, it is therefore permitted to interrupt for it even in the middle of Pesukei DeZimra. However, even
according to this, since he has already said Baruch She’amar, the necessary ascent has already been accomplished
through the Kaddish, and there is no rectification achieved by saying the Kaddish (see Kaf HaChaim siman 53
se’if katan 13, and Responsa Rav Pe’alim, volume 2, siman 14).
Sources and expansion:
In Responsa Maharshag (volume 1, siman 48), he wrote simply that it is permitted to interrupt
during Pesukei DeZimra in order to say Mourner’s Kaddish, and his proof is from the fact that it is permitted
to interrupt in Pesukei DeZimra because of honor [and for this reason it is permitted to inquire
after one’s parents’ welfare during Pesukei DeZimra]; and since saying Mourner’s Kaddish is an honor
for one’s father and mother after their death, he may interrupt in order to say it even in the middle of
Pesukei DeZimra. So too wrote the Responsa Rav Pe’alim (volume 2, Orach Chaim siman 14), that if he does not say Kaddish for them, it will appear in the eyes of the congregation as though he is belittling and degrading the honor of his parents. And so he brought in Elef HaMagen (on the Mateh Ephraim, laws of Mourner’s Kaddish, Sha’ar 4, se’if katan 8) in the name of
the Acharonim, that a mourner who is in the middle of Pesukei DeZimra says Mourner’s Kaddish; and he added that although it is a great leniency to interrupt in the middle of
Pesukei DeZimra, nevertheless since this is the view of the Acharonim, this is how one should conduct himself. However, he wrote
that it appears to him that if he will later find a minyan in which to say Kaddish, he should not interrupt in the middle of Pesukei DeZimra (and see Responsa Levushei Mordechai, volume 1, siman 112).
And that which was explained, that one should say it between the chapters and at the very least in a place
where the subject has concluded, is from the aforementioned Mateh Ephraim.
